The Persecuted Hyper Preterist
One thing I’ve noticed from Hyper-Preterists I’ve personally met online so far is that 100 percent of them are the most persecuted people I’ve ever met. In their own minds that is. Now there a few I’ve been following who seem legitimately persuaded in their eschatological interpretation but are not on the internet playing “block the challenger” football. Some of them just don’t have the time for foolishness and tit for tat debates and arguments that turn into personality riffs. RC Sproul is one such fellow. I believe he’s wrong on a lot of issues, but he is not a pretender or a wannabe. He’s the real deal and seems to be a nice guy.
It’s the other ones I’m talking about, They’re a whole nuther animal. And each one has their own personal fan club. Once you go to one of their forums or Facebook or YouTube or even one of their websites they will usually pretend to be interested in your questions. One of the most popular questions they get is “If the resurrection is passed, where is your hope?” Most of the time the host or moderator will tell you first answers these questions so we can have a base to proceed with. They have a list of about 10 to 14 questions for you. And they will point out to you how you have been following men instead of the Bible. The next time you ask a question without first entertaining their list, the whole group of followers will flock like sea gulls. Once you brush off the sea gulls and get back to the head guy you will have realized you never got an answer, just a lot of hot air and bloviating and not much else. After that the “Oh woe is us” begins to pile on. Seriously. I’ve never seen anything like it until I became interested in this new Hyper Preterist doctrine.
Recently I have listened to a couple of John Watson’s sermons on his church Facebook page. I challenged him on several points he was making and he took it as attacks on him and deleted the questions I posed. That was after all of the sea gulls had jumped in and they took offense because I told them I want John to answer. One man named Roy Runyon in particular posted a challenge for me with John’s permission. He went through several points he wanted me to answer in a friendly enough way. He began with this,
"""With John's permission, I would like to tag Tim Russell here (because John's page somehow receives a TON more views that mine), and invite Tim to engage me in a cordial and respectful discussion, since Tim is convinced that Realized Eschatology is something new and is a false doctrine."""
Sounds reasonable enough right? Well right after he posted several points, he posted this gem without having anything challenged. He said this,
""This argument has demonstrated itself to be irrefutable, because refuting this argument requires one to refute Jesus' interpretation and application of the Danielic prophecies cited above, and that, Tim, is impossible since I know you will agree that it is impossible for God to lie.""
You see that? His opinion is equal to that of Jesus and therefore anyone who disagree with Roy is disagreeing with Jesus! Well, I wouldn’t want to argue with, so I told Roy “No Thanks” Besides it’s John page and John is who I wanted to deal with not Roy Runyon. Nevertheless, John right on que deleted my questions to him and of course he was the persecuted victim. But this next one is my favorite of all time so far. This one comes from Trent Parrott. Watson and Parrott recently did a YouTube clip where Trent pretended to be a fellow named Wooten and asked questions and made statements on Wooten’s behalf. The video is still up btw. Regardless of where you stand on the issue of their false doctrine it is a shameful and dishonorable thing they did. And yet They are the victims and claim they are being persecuted just as Paul warned about. So here it is my favorite claim of persecution from John Watson’s YouTube sidekick, Seriously, where is my world’s smallest fiddle so I can play along as we re-read this together. Take note at the very end he added a lot of other names he was speaking for on his behalf. Mr. Parrott seems to speak for a lot of people other them Mr. Wooten.
Trent Parrott; Mark Wooten had every opportunity numerous times to talk to John privately but, he refused and chose to keep publicly mocking, insulting and misrepresenting what we believe and teach. He is a pompous troll who hides behind a computer doing his attacks to discourage open and honest discussion with people studying eschatology. Wooten was encouraged and invited to call the program to defend his doctrine but, chose to do what you religious reprobates do time and again. That’s what you futurists do, you cannot answer in the now so, you go on the offensive over the computer like you’re doing in this post!
You have no idea how rotten we’ve been treated by people who worshipped with us and were our brethren for years. Nor do you receive the constant barrage of insults, condemnation and smear campaigns that we’ve had to endure for many years now. All but just an extremely small number of our detractors agreed to or attempted to study with us. Everyone of them backed out as soon we began to ask questions. They, in turn, tried to destroy us by false accusations and misrepresentations. I knew many of these people intimately for years and I saw long ago how they didn’t study the Bible, they paid a preacher to tell them what to believe. To this day, hundreds of these people couldn’t tell you the first thing about the Bible beyond children stories and baptism. They are lazy and purposely ignorant in their studies.
Admit it honestly, the biggest issue with you denominational church of Christ enforcers who troll our videos and posts, is that we started fighting back against you religious reprobates and bullies! You cannot stand the fact that we no longer sit and take the relentless attacks! It is making you more angry that we call you out on your hardened hearts and willful dishonesty! Your behaviors mirror much of what the Jews did to the first century Christians. Like you, they all believed they were righteous but, became blood thirsty in their pursuit of the Christians to destroy them.
None of us is backing down and I am not a passive Christian when being accused and lied about. You phony Christians got so used to scaring people away by your threats of disfellowship and smear campaigns that you became too comfortable and self-righteous that it seems heretical to you that another church of Christ Christian dares to call you out.
You have no idea the number of hours, years of study on biblical eschatology and the losses we have suffered through with the hardships incurred from you self-righteous trolls. Like many in the futurist churches of Christ, you depend on a library full on recycled study guides, woefully prepared sermons and belligerent elders & ministers who own their brothers by intimidation and fear tactics. It’s a tragedy to witness the demise of the church of Christ in the USA as it becomes more of a denomination rather than the Lord’s church! When you want to sincerely study and can be courteous in discussion, let us know because we are not taking your attitude and approach any longer.
Bobby Allison Brent Bischel Robert Buna Mario Watson Beasley Sr. Don K. Preston Steven Baisden Scott Klaft Holger Neubauer Michael Zane Trusty Tim Ogles Kenneth Rooster Morgan Billy Williams Roy Runyon Brian Stokes Bowers W Jerry Mark Ingersoll Mark Glenn Don Latham
As this post points out, these Hyper Preterist are severely persecuted in their own minds. Besides their false, and I believe heretical doctrine as a common denominator, I believe you will also find them to enjoy being the victim. Almost all of them claim to either be or are former church of Christ but being persecuted over challenges to their doctrine is their favorite pastime. Yet according to their doctrine they are in heaven and there is no more sin, pain, crying, fears, death, or bad emotions.
Yeah, I don’t get it either. You can find it all on John Watson’s Facebook and scroll down to the video mocking Mark Wooten if you’re interested.
Kyle Pope a church of Christ preacher from Texas wrote a book in 2019 titled “Thinking About A.D. 70”. You can probably still find it at CEI bookstore in Athens Al. I got one when it first came out. And it’s a very good book challenging A.D. 70 doctrine. It drove Don K Preston absolutely batty. So much so Preston did about 20 videos on YouTube trying to refute Kyle Pope. Brother Pope did one two-hour video to rebut Preston and ended it saying he is finished arguing about it with Preston. Preston still to this day will mention Pope from time to time. It’s just too much for Don to bear such a heavy load knowing Kyle Pope’s book is out there brilliantly knocking down the Hyper Preterist’s doctrine while at the same time showing what the gospel actually is. But not agreeing with them, refuting them, daring to write a book knocking their doctrine out of the ballpark is “persecution” to them. The bowls of woe is upon them.
You can find Don K Preston on his YouTube channel
When any group of people validate themselves by being a victim then we tend to be more suspicious. The Gospel, “The Good News” is not about victimhood. Paul did say to Timothy in 2 Timothy 3:12 that all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will suffer persecution. Paul is not talking about correcting men who deny the law was nailed to the cross, or those who claim Paul taught the Jews the law was a valid path to salvation before A.D. 70. These Hyper Preterists preachers usually lose their jobs after they start preaching their Max King doctrine and they call that “Persecution” as Trent above defines Christian persecution. Sam Frost is an ex Hyper Preterist and he tells the story of when he and others were talking about how to spread this doctrine in a way that would work and not shock people away from it. He said they were going to plant teachers in local congregations in a secretive way. He says he thought of 2nd Peter 2 verse one where Peter warns the churches, “
If people have to sneak a doctrine in then redlights should go off. If their doctrine is true and valid then there was no reason to make plans and arrangements to sneak it in. Even if their doctrine was valid and part of the gospel of Christ, it is a sinful thing to play hide and seek with the gospel. The Apostles were beaten, jailed, martyred, and persecuted in every way for Boldly proclaiming the gospel of Christ. Yet here these men are like John Watson and Trent Parrott claiming “persecution” as they make a YouTube video ridiculing Mr. Wooten, mocking him, and frankly lying about him then accuse him of attacking them. I’ve seen some of the same kind of things for myself over the last 2 or 3 years. It glides off me like water on a duck. To them according to their doctrine, the judgment is passed, Hell is not eternal punishment, and they are already in heaven. So with that being said let them play the victim. They have their reward. One day the rest of us will really be in Heaven where there are no victims of persecution and the debates are over.